Solve : dead computer puzzle?

1.	Solve : dead computer puzzle?
Answer» Anyone know why a longtime reliable laptop (Dell D410) would not respond at all? When I couldn't fix the problem, I installed a new (used) mb, CERTAIN that would do the trick--but it did not. It is worse than XP not booting -- that would be easy. I cannot --enter BIOS setup (f2) --enter start-up choices (f8) --enter boot sequence (f12) --cannot use Knoppix, Recovery Console or any Live CD because cannot boot off the CD drive. The CD drive does not even power up. The Dell logo does not come on. No DOS screen on any kind. There is not even a blinking cursor, nothing! What does happen is that the little green "power" light stays on when the system is powered. When I depress the "on" button, another little green light indicating the system is on stays lit for a few seconds--further proof the machine is powered--then dies. I have swapped in and out two HDDs, including one I carefully tested. The screen is broken you say? Hooked up to an external monitor (even with the LCD cable disconnected) and still nada: black as black. I have swapped in and out memory, including a new stick of GSkill PC5300 DDR 2 I recently bought. About the only thing I haven't done that I can think of is to buy a used external optical drive module on the off chance the CD drive is dead. I did have a bad hard drive (bad sectors) that had file CORRUPTION, and was in the process of putting in a new hard drive when this happened. I used the system recovery disk to install Windows on he new HDD. No problem. I had made a complete drive image (clone) of the bad disk and tried to restore it to the new disc, and this failed. I learned since that cloning a disk with bad sectors transfers the messed up table. That is why I bought the new system board. But with a new mobo, how could the problem be reoccurring. Oh - because of the bad hard drive, I had disable Paging Executive to keep all the page code in RAM, where I figured it was safer than on a failing disc, but that was in the previous motherboard--such a setting would not be transferred to a new one. I is stumped! Richard But Quote from: rihiggins on April 01, 2012, 09:07:03 PM But with a new mobo, how could the problem be reoccurring. I is stumped! I have no idea too... you have basically replaced everything that you can replace... The last thing that comes to mind is a problem with the DC power jack... I'm close to positive its not the CPU; if you attempt to boot a PC without the CPU all you get is fans running indefinitely. But yours shuts off. Have you tried booting with the charger only and without the battery inserted? Have you tried booting with only the battery inserted? Have you tried resetting CMOS by taking out the CMOS battery and waiting 10 mins before putting it back in?Are you doing computer repair at home? Repair of laptops is more difficult than desktops and the proper test materials cost more. Unlike Coffee Pots and Toasters, your need more that a voltmeter and some screwdrivers if you want to repair popular laptop out of warranty. The test materials you need tend to be specific to the brand you work on. For the Dell model you MENTION, you have to have about $200 worth of specific parts and components to work on it. This is not economical unless your are leasing out scores of these laptops to commercial users who prefer to lease rather that buy. Otherwise, for small volume repair, that model is not repairable beyond replacing keyboard and battery. You can buy a good used one for about $160 on eBay from a reputable vendor. This is not a joke. This is from years of electronic repair, including a few laptops. Quote from: rihiggins on April 01, 2012, 09:07:03 PM I learned since that cloning a disk with bad sectors transfers the messed up table. That is why I bought the new system board. But with a new mobo, how could the problem be reoccurring. Eh... you lost me here. Yes, cloning a disk with bad sectors will screw up the image. I'm not sure how that made you think you needed a new motherboard. The table has nothing to do with the motherboard. When changing a motherboard in a laptop, there are usually many many little cables connected to it that go to various other parts. Sometimes if those aren't reconnected problem and securely, the computer just won't work. I would suggest starting over with your explanation and be more specific as to what happened in the first place before you changed the motherboard. Also, buying an external CD drive will get you no where, at this point. Chances are, as I said, you didn't get the CD drive connected properly again and that's why it's not working. If you MUST, disassemble it again, then follow Dell's Service Guide for connecting the components correctly: http://support.dell.com/support/edocs/systems/latd410/en/sm/index.htmThank you Quaxo! Yes, new board was not rational, as I had wiped the drive to which I tried to copy the flawed image. But after a while, when I couldn't do brain surgery, I decided to replace the brain, hoping to get back up and figure out later what went wrong. No such luck. Changing the board-I did follow the service manual, of course, but it is distressingly thin on detail. I'm concerned that you say "many many" little cables. I didn't find that. I saw four ribbon cables to reconnect--video, button board, touchpad ("palm rest connector") and keyboard--and did not connect two others - the smart card reader Bluetooth. (Have never used either.) In addition to those four ribbon cables were two plastic pin connectors--for the fan and speaker. The HDD connector looks soldered onto the board. So there were only six things to plug in beside screwing this and that, and I must say it seemed too easy. But I examined the manual and both boards minutely and don't know if I missed anything. What happened prior was my HDD was failing. I intermittently and randomly couldn't log on, but I would usually get the F8 screen. I found just going into and out of BIOS without doing anything sometimes allowed me to start up. The errors were file system and memory related - 0A, 50, 1A, 24, 07E, 8E, D1, 4E. I was perhaps lazy and overconfident I could jiggle the machine and replace the HDD when I was good and ready. Finally, it wouldn't start and I took out the CMOS battery. That worked like a charm, then I did that a few times and, soon as I installed the new HDD, it didn't work. The machine has been very uneventful since then, like an old dog. It just opens one little green eye when I press the power button and then shuts it and goes back to sleep. To Lieutenant Confusion, Thank you for reply. I did do the CMOS battery trick and it stopped working. I did try to start with only the ADAPTER and only battery with no difference. But my best guess is that you are in the right area-power supply. It is just so frustrating not be to be able to run any tests, bring in any outside resource via an external drive etc. Thanks Rich

Answer»

Anyone know why a longtime reliable laptop (Dell D410) would not respond at all?

When I couldn't fix the problem, I installed a new (used) mb, CERTAIN that would do the trick--but it did not. It is worse than XP not booting -- that would be easy. I cannot
--enter BIOS setup (f2)
--enter start-up choices (f8)
--enter boot sequence (f12)
--cannot use Knoppix, Recovery Console or any Live CD because cannot boot off the CD drive. The CD drive does not even power up.

The Dell logo does not come on. No DOS screen on any kind. There is not even a blinking cursor, nothing!

What does happen is that the little green "power" light stays on when the system is powered. When I depress the "on" button, another little green light indicating the system is on stays lit for a few seconds--further proof the machine is powered--then dies.

I have swapped in and out two HDDs, including one I carefully tested.

The screen is broken you say? Hooked up to an external monitor (even with the LCD cable disconnected) and still nada: black as black.

I have swapped in and out memory, including a new stick of GSkill PC5300 DDR 2 I recently bought.

About the only thing I haven't done that I can think of is to buy a used external optical drive module on the off chance the CD drive is dead.

I did have a bad hard drive (bad sectors) that had file CORRUPTION, and was in the process of putting in a new hard drive when this happened. I used the system recovery disk to install Windows on he new HDD. No problem. I had made a complete drive image (clone) of the bad disk and tried to restore it to the new disc, and this failed. I learned since that cloning a disk with bad sectors transfers the messed up table. That is why I bought the new system board. But with a new mobo, how could the problem be reoccurring.

Oh - because of the bad hard drive, I had disable Paging Executive to keep all the page code in RAM, where I figured it was safer than on a failing disc, but that was in the previous motherboard--such a setting would not be transferred to a new one.

I is stumped!

Richard

But Quote from: rihiggins on April 01, 2012, 09:07:03 PM

But with a new mobo, how could the problem be reoccurring.
I is stumped!

I have no idea too... you have basically replaced everything that you can replace...

The last thing that comes to mind is a problem with the DC power jack... I'm close to positive its not the CPU; if you attempt to boot a PC without the CPU all you get is fans running indefinitely. But yours shuts off.
Have you tried booting with the charger only and without the battery inserted? Have you tried booting with only the battery inserted? Have you tried resetting CMOS by taking out the CMOS battery and waiting 10 mins before putting it back in?Are you doing computer repair at home? Repair of laptops is more difficult than desktops and the proper test materials cost more.

Unlike Coffee Pots and Toasters, your need more that a voltmeter and some screwdrivers if you want to repair popular laptop out of warranty.

The test materials you need tend to be specific to the brand you work on. For the Dell model you MENTION, you have to have about $200 worth of specific parts and components to work on it. This is not economical unless your are leasing out scores of these laptops to commercial users who prefer to lease rather that buy.

Otherwise, for small volume repair, that model is not repairable beyond replacing keyboard and battery. You can buy a good used one for about $160 on eBay from a reputable vendor.

This is not a joke.
This is from years of electronic repair, including a few laptops.
Quote from: rihiggins on April 01, 2012, 09:07:03 PM

I learned since that cloning a disk with bad sectors transfers the messed up table. That is why I bought the new system board. But with a new mobo, how could the problem be reoccurring.

Eh... you lost me here.

Yes, cloning a disk with bad sectors will screw up the image. I'm not sure how that made you think you needed a new motherboard. The table has nothing to do with the motherboard.

When changing a motherboard in a laptop, there are usually many many little cables connected to it that go to various other parts. Sometimes if those aren't reconnected problem and securely, the computer just won't work.

I would suggest starting over with your explanation and be more specific as to what happened in the first place before you changed the motherboard.

Also, buying an external CD drive will get you no where, at this point. Chances are, as I said, you didn't get the CD drive connected properly again and that's why it's not working.

If you MUST, disassemble it again, then follow Dell's Service Guide for connecting the components correctly:
http://support.dell.com/support/edocs/systems/latd410/en/sm/index.htmThank you Quaxo!

Yes, new board was not rational, as I had wiped the drive to which I tried to copy the flawed image. But after a while, when I couldn't do brain surgery, I decided to replace the brain, hoping to get back up and figure out later what went wrong. No such luck.

Changing the board-I did follow the service manual, of course, but it is distressingly thin on detail. I'm concerned that you say "many many" little cables. I didn't find that. I saw four ribbon cables to reconnect--video, button board, touchpad ("palm rest connector") and keyboard--and did not connect two others - the smart card reader Bluetooth. (Have never used either.) In addition to those four ribbon cables were two plastic pin connectors--for the fan and speaker. The HDD connector looks soldered onto the board. So there were only six things to plug in beside screwing this and that, and I must say it seemed too easy. But I examined the manual and both boards minutely and don't know if I missed anything.

What happened prior was my HDD was failing. I intermittently and randomly couldn't log on, but I would usually get the F8 screen. I found just going into and out of BIOS without doing anything sometimes allowed me to start up. The errors were file system and memory related - 0A, 50, 1A, 24, 07E, 8E, D1, 4E. I was perhaps lazy and overconfident I could jiggle the machine and replace the HDD when I was good and ready.

Finally, it wouldn't start and I took out the CMOS battery. That worked like a charm, then I did that a few times and, soon as I installed the new HDD, it didn't work.

The machine has been very uneventful since then, like an old dog. It just opens one little green eye when I press the power button and then shuts it and goes back to sleep.

To Lieutenant Confusion,
Thank you for reply. I did do the CMOS battery trick and it stopped working. I did try to start with only the ADAPTER and only battery with no difference. But my best guess is that you are in the right area-power supply. It is just so frustrating not be to be able to run any tests, bring in any outside resource via an external drive etc.
Thanks
Rich

Solve : dead computer puzzle?

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